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Yeah, but why is this in shitpost, though.
I’m open to suggestion!
Political memes? https://lemmy.ca/c/politicalmemes@lemmy.world
I often post there, but this isn’t a ‘meme’.
Here’s the recreation:LOL. I totally didn’t realize I commented on your meme, before commenting on your shit post. HUGS. So, yeah, looks like you already got all the bases covered.
I was looping the same way.
cheers,
Microblog posts? !micro@reddthat.com
Agreed!
Thanks for next time!
Shit Reality, Shit Post
It’s a Midas shitpost.
Missed a detail: any criticism of the scumbag is now considered “celebration” or “justification”. We hated him before he died, but now we cannot say that. Because of the Fuhrer at all.
Nope, if you talk to anyone on the right currently, everything the administration is doing right now is fine and they have broken no laws.
“Oh the democrats have done much worse.” When i ask them what things democrats have done that are close to what republicans do, they always bring up forcing kids to become trans or giving them hormones in school.
People really are that out of touch with reality.
They are fascists.
Period.
They fit the definition.
They are fascists.
They might be stupid fascists that don’t even know it, but that doesn’t change that they’re fascists.
And fascists are liars
To them any concept of socialism or human rights is considered communism or lgbtq+ . They smear themselves in fascist excrements, coming straight from the orange pudding’s ass.
People really are that out of touch with reality.
there’s a portion that are ignorant sure. and there’s a portion that leverages that ignorance as a shield to deny their fascist motivations.
they’re both awful.
Did they provide any real world examples?
yeah they saw it on facebook or truth social
I have had the same experience and its frustrating. I mentioned Trumps claim that all his actions are legal, and his reply was “well it was ok when Biden said it”, like a knee-jerk reaction.
I had to JackieChan_WHAT.jpg while driving.
Do we know about the political views of the suspect? I know he supports guns but that does not make you automatically right wing
This is one of the biggest problems with our current state of polarization: we’re quick to box people into a binary; either “red” or “blue,” “left” or “right.”
Real people rarely fit neatly into those categories. When you take the time to actually map out someone’s beliefs, experiences, and values, what you find almost never looks like a solid block of one color. Instead, it’s more like a mosaic: someone might lean conservative on economic issues, progressive on social ones, independent when it comes to foreign policy, and undecided on others.
Reducing all of that complexity down to a single partisan label is not only misleading, it also fuels division. It makes it harder to have real conversations, because instead of engaging with the full person (their reasoning, contradictions, and growth), we engage with a caricature. Recognizing that most people carry a mix of beliefs forces us to slow down, listen, and resist the urge to collapse identities into overly simple categories.
The challenge is that this feels counterintuitive, especially for people who haven’t examined why they hold the views they do. It’s easier, and often more comforting, to inherit an identity or adopt a team than it is to wrestle with contradictions and gray areas. But when we refuse that deeper work, we not only misunderstand others, we also misunderstand ourselves.
In other words, the messiness is the point. People are complicated, and when we acknowledge that, we create more space for dialogue, empathy, and genuine understanding; the very things that binary polarization squeezes out.
Edit:
If you’re interested in seeing how this plays out in practice, the New York Times put together a quiz a few years back that illustrates the point really well:
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/09/08/opinion/republicans-democrats-parties.html
Is there a way to interact with this quiz that doesn’t involve me giving the NYT a dollar?
Very well said, this is how i think as well. Here in switzerland it is exactly the same even though we have 5 major parties to choose from. This is also why direct democracy in switzerland is so amazing. You choose people that represent the parliment in parties while you still can vote different in referendums than your chosen party does.
From what I’ve pieced together, it’s a guy from a MAGA family that was recently radicalized, possibly in college towards left-wingism (possibly via exposure and humanization of trans room mate?). There’s not that much evidence to suggest he was a far-righter himself (the groyper claims are literally just “yeah the engravings are a dogwhistle trust me bro” but many libs here are buying it), and now it’s just turning into a war of push from both sides being like “no it’s not OUR guy it’s YOUR guy!”.
In other words, it’s impossible to tell for certain due to how deliberately muddied the waters are by everyone.
There’s equal evidence for the groyper claim as there is for the trans roommate claim, which is to say nothing but hearsay being pushed out by the Governor of Utah.
MAGA was screaming that it was a radical leftist without ANY evidence… They are just looking for an excuse to justify using force against political opponents
He went to UVU one semester and then left and went to trade school as an electrical apprentice. I highly doubt he got radicalized at college in Utah. He was already radicalized by his parents and family in the MAGA / Mormon spheres. It takes longer than a semester to deconstruct cult level beliefs like that. There is very little to any evidence that his roommate is trans. It is all hearsay picked up from places like 4-chan then spread to right-wing rags then spread to right wing politicans. A big loooong game of telephone. It isn’t even clear he lived there at the time of the shooting. The Daily Mail said he lives with his family in a $600,000 six-bedroom home.
The reason the trans - fan fic is getting spread by right-wingers is that the federal authorities are using it to get jurisdiction from the state since that could make it classify as a hate crime. Even if the roommate is trans that doesn’t mean they aren’t a right-wing trans person. Trans people can have shitty views just like any other group of people.
It doesn’t help that the FBI and news outlets are releasing different info to different news audiences to muddy the waters. Just the meta-data of this being the 3rd trans related storyline being pushed does not inspire confidence in it’s veracity. The first TRN one was debunked and retracted, but then they claim the engravings point to trans- ideology when that isn’t really apparent. Then they come up with another one. Sorry, not buying right-wingers making shit up to blame it on trans people.
Hold on… A hate crime? Jesus fucking Christ. Being a fascist asshole is 100% a choice. And their entire existence is a fucking hate crime.
The Trump regime doesn’t want a local jury of Mormon peers, they want to execute him federally and have control of the trial so that inconvenient information doesn’t come out.
If this kid had been “radicalized towards left-wingism” in any way, the media would be all over it and we wouldn’t be hearing the end of it.
Ding ding ding ding.
When you hear that he’s “not cooperating” today, that means the regime can’t convince him to tell everyone he’s really a liberal.
From what I’ve heard, he was from a right wing family but there are conflicting reports on whether he himself was right wing
Probably a libertarian. Non party affiliated has been growing as people arent into fascist Republicans vs fiscal conservative policy and they dont want to be a Democrat in those states.
I know we have this, you are one party of the other thing but i think the “others” is gonna get bigger as a group and already has.
This is what i read as well. While not likely, it is totally possible he is not right wing
He was apparently dating a transgender person. That doesn’t necessarily make him left wing, but it means that in regards to transgender people, he probably didn’t fully agree with the right wing
Not all right wingers are against trans people. I‘d be surprised if ecen 50% are
I think “we’re” going to end up with a lot of egg on our faces the more they investigate. I believe his parents have already told the authorities that “he’s been getting more into left wing ideology in the recent years” so I’m pretty sure its just a matter of time before it’s “proven.”
The only thing people have to go off of now is some tenuous connection to Nick Fuentes that doesn’t seem too solid.
This kid was different. He is not one of us! /S
What was fucking hilarious was the governor got on to reassure all Utahns that he was not like his parents, community, or state when he clearly is.
Your musings don’t matter he has already been branded by the liars as a leftist and your just here to sweep up after them like a good lackey.
Why the hell would I want to “sweet up” after them? I even used the term “we’re” to distinguish the fact that I’m not a right winger. I’m simply trying to stick to the only facts we have, I’m not letting what I want to be real get in the way of what reality seems to be.
I’m one of the last people who wants this to be a left wing guy, but I also won’t plug my ears and choose to believe something that might not be true based on some loose connections.
Where did you see he was turning left? Given his background with groupers, he’s got Internet brain rot and is trying to play lefty while doing what he did for the reasons stated are hardcore radical right.
In an article I read they stated that his parents were supposedly saying he started turning to the left in recent years. Whether that is true or not remains to be seen, but it would at least partially explain his not voting for Republicans and registration as independent.
What background has been proven that he has a history with groypers? The only thing I’ve seen are the bullet engravings, but unfortunately he managed to pick every single meme that could go either way… They all have a history of starting one way and being used in another, even the helldiver’s reference could be a fascist misunderstanding the point of helldiver’s, or a left winger understanding and using it as anti-fascist.
The article I saw said he was getting more “political“ recently, not explicitly more left-wing…
I wish I had it saved since I’m at work and can’t do a good enough search, but yeah the quick search I’m doing now is only pulling up “more political.” Could have been that the article was wrong and has since been corrected.
Yeah and if he had been getting more lefty they would have said that, not the intentionally vague “more political”.
If you didn’t vote in '22 or '24, and had the ability, you’re not a progressive or liberal, full stop.
Consider the source. Hard-core Righties consider anyone who isn’t as right wing as them to be Liberals. They could check every box in Conservative Bingo, but if they have the slightest concern about deporting people without due process, they are as Liberal as a San Francisco Homo.
You can’t let MAGAs choose the labels.
LOL.
Boomers complaining people are “turning left” cause their kid asked if Jesus really meant it when he said to feed the poor and treat others with human decency.
Yeah, it’s probably the fact that he went to college for a semester. To them that means he was indoctrinated into leftism.
Sweep up is a reference to cleaning up.
It doesn’t matter what you think or even I think. They already branded him as leftist. They are already attacking innocent people with political violence like the terrorists they are.
The reality is he was raised conservative in a conservative religion, in a conservative family, in a conservative town, and in a conservative state. He is one of them. They know this, I know this, but you seem confused.
They have a name for this and it is useful idiot.
I understand what sweep up means… I was saying that’s not what I’d want to be doing and it isn’t what I was attempting to do.
As for useful idiot, you’re literally assuming you know what you claim to be true… Just like you said, what you think or what I think doesn’t matter. I’m not “helping” them by my comment suggesting that we might end up embarrassed if they do end up having actual proof he’s a “left winger.” I’m of the mind that this is unfortunately more likely than not to be the case.
It is okay, you got caught up in the propaganda of what was his political leanings left or right. I am just here to tell you that your doing exactly what they want you to do. Hence the useful idiot
I am assuming the truth. Just like OP said. He is a product of conservative culture regardless if he embraced or denied it.
deleted by creator
Not sure why you’re getting downvoted. At face value alone the alleged “Hey Fascist, Catch!” text on the casing is not something a right winger would say about their own ideological cousin, and if true as well, the shooter may have dated a trans individual. The preponderance of the circumstantial evidence we’ve been told (albeit with the caveat that we can’t trust news orgs that are kissing the ring) would seem to point towards the shooter aligning with left-leaning traits.
Edit: you downvoters need to check your cancel votes at the door. Just because there’s a possibility you might dislike the reality of the situation not turning out how you’d like.
Don’t forget the arrows after the quote, though
It’s a reference to Helldivers 2, and a sufficiently brainrotted individual might very well just put internet references on there. Which he did. And it’s not like right wingers haven’t been misusing political terms for ages. Remember the term “feminazi”?
The shooter seems to have been involved in some deep internet culture and communities. You can’t just treat it like standard opinions, but under that internet lens, which is far less straightforward and filled with codewords. From an outside perspective a lot of that might seem straight up nonsensical when put together. My point is is simply that it’s inconclusive
Not that it matters much anyhow, as republicans will pin it on the left and trans people no matter what. They’re gearing up for a genocide and will use any excuse available
It’s definitely frustrating to see people absolutely refuse to accept that it might not be what they want it to be, meanwhile they’ll point to the right and laugh when they do it.
I’m just trying not to let what I want to be true make me believe 100% that it couldn’t be anything else. It’s kinda like the Epstein distraction “meme” that’s getting a bit frustrating… Every single thing that happens is suddenly branded a distraction from Epstein, completely ignoring more realistic reasoning for what is being done… Like Venezuela, we’re going to war with Venezuela not to cover for Epstein, but for one of a few reasons: as Carlin said “we’re an oil company with a military.” or to allow deportations to continue using the foreign enemies distinction that he was denied earlier as “we aren’t at war with the cartel” … Well now we are, or will be.
I am a big time left wing guy and I love guns. Of course I believe in gun control, but I do not believe in most gun bans.
Me too. I am left wing and shoot guns weekly. I live in switzerland and it is not a issue at all because there are strict regulations. You cannot aquire an automatic rifle without special permissions.
The problem is that some countries, like Canada, are hell bent on destroying shooting sports. No joke. The gun bans in canada over the past 5 years (there have been no changes in the licensing schemes, BTW, meaning it is not harder to get a gun than it was) is effectively turning almost all shooting sport variations untenable.
It is stupid and they need to stop that. The licensing scheme is fine enough, they don’t need to ban every semi-automatic rifle in existence or stop new handguns from being sold. The regulations on handguns in Canada were highly effective and they could have even legalized pocket pistols for collecting and casual sport shooting and it would not have made a difference.
Is this actually true? There’s too much disinformation about the shooter, his motivations, his identity, his family, his partner going around that I have no clue what to really believe about him.
(Please, nobody respond to this comment telling me “that’s exactly what they want” without providing a credible source for your claims about the shooter. If you do provide sources, then you are welcome to make fun of me for being skeptical.)
I will point out one thing that should be obvious, the shooter was only 22. So it’s possible he doesn’t have a very baked and stable political ideology. I knew a hard core outwardly homophobic conservative at 17 who came out as gay and did theater by 20. I knew a fairly liberal person when she was about 18 that over the years got to a place where she publicly praised Trump and called COVID a hoax and the vaccine a conspiracy. No idea how that happened, even as I saw it first hand.
Given the situation, it is at least clear he was unhinged if he would get to this point, either way. I would have hoped this would be a lesson for people that people get dangerously moved by angry rhetoric, but a lot of folks are ramping up rhetoric instead.
A very fair point indeed
We don’t have confirmation on all of his motives yet; however what we do know about the shooter, his upbringing, lifestyle, etc. is that the poster responding to OP in the image above is largely correct.
There are indeed conflicting accounts that his roommate was trans, or his partner was, or similar. None of that’s been verified yet, and even if so, it doesn’t explain the shooter’s motivations.
What we do know about the shooter is that he largely fits the model of a deeply conservative republican, and that fits with how he was raised, his family, and as his grandmother puts it: “Their family was all MAGA”.
Going off that, and a lot of other circumstantial details/evidence, it’s clear that he was at one point a deeply MAGA character.
Beyond that or what his current motivations are? We can only extrapolate. Those extrapolations largely lead in the direction that he shot Kirk because Kirk didn’t back some of the same extremist beliefs he held. Those beliefs are similar to what Nick Fuentes believes in, which is also why he’s currently being labeled a Gyroper.
According to The Onion, he once had a trans Uber driver so that obviously makes him a leftist.
Fair enough, but I think we shouldn’t be basing our inferences about the shooter from his family’s political leanings. My feeling is that somebody who does something so drastic is likely enough to be an outlier from their family that we can’t really know one way or the other.
A big reason why that’s important, as long as it’s done with care, is because conservatives rely on the rhetoric that purely white, conservative communities would be without crime. This kid grew up in a prime setting to show how amazing their way of life is without any “evil leftist” influences and yet here we are. The US has been given every opportunity to show how great theocratic conservative capitalism is and yet it keeps failing because the reality is that it fucking sucks rocks.
if he’s a leftist, then of course he had “evil leftist” influences. The internet exists.
According to some right-wing spaces (r/conservative on Reddit), there is apparently evidence to suggest that the shooter was an outlier within their otherwise hard-right family.
Is there any evidence to the contrary?
Nobody has direct evidence of the shooter’s motivations or political affiliation today. Nobody.
That could change, but today this is true.
Any evidence we have is circumstantial. Most of that circumstantial evidence points in the direction of an extreme right winger.
I’m sure there’s some circumstantial evidence pointing in the opposite direction, but it pales in comparison to the circumstantial evidence pointing in the far right direction.
Much of the circumstantial evidence pointing away from the far right came from a mis-attribution from the FBI to a trans rights marker that was debunked as categorically untrue. Or statements from the Utah Gov which are (AFAIK) not backed up by any actual evidence other than how he “wishes” it was. Or from Trump who is known for lying and making things up.
I’d be curious what evidence they have that hasn’t been announced/released yet that makes them think that.
I suspect they want it to be true that he was left leaning and they may be assigning too great a weight on the debunked FBI claims, the Utah Gov claims, and Trump’s claims; despite most of the circumstantial evidence that’s been released so far pointing in the direction of him being far right.
To be clear, this could change later today if the investigators were to release evidence about the shooter’s motivations. Until then, all we’ve got to go on is what circumstantial stuff has been released so far, and that’s largely pointing in the direction of the far right.
Nobody has direct evidence of the shooter’s motivations or political affiliation today. Nobody.
From the texts between him and his roomate that have been publicly released. Source: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/sep/16/charlie-kirk-shooting-prosecutor-utah
“Roommate: ‘Why?’ Robinson: ‘Why did I do it?’ Roommate: ‘Yeah.“’ Robinson: ‘I had enough of his hatred. Some hate can’t be negotiated out.”
So, we have his direct statement to his transwoman roommate as to his motive, either you can take that at face value or claim it’s some carefully crafted lie intentionally meant to deceive us as to his real motives. You do you.
I wouldn’t trust anyone describing his political leanings or motives until court. It’s being twisted around and rumors are spreading like wildfire in a vacuum of actual leadership.
I’d even say all indications are that his leanings don’t matter in the specifics of this event.
It’s probably more informative that folks can credibly have theories for either leaning to lead to this event. Lots of reasons that could believably drive any political leaning over the edge if they are close.
His trail’s probably a long way away, isn’t it?
That’s a good question. I honestly don’t know, they’ll probably try to hang him on primetime tv as soon as legally possible.
I just keep hearing about discord and 4chan and how he’s got a trans roommate/girlfriend/landlord. If anyone has any reputable sources I’m interested. I just feel like cable news, the Trump admin, and the Internet are all reporting 24/7 on something they need to investigate.
At least people face consequences for lying under oath. Well in theory.
Earlier in the briefing, Gray said investigators had spoken to Robinson’s mother, who said her son had, over the last year “become more political and had started to lean more to the left, becoming more pro-gay and trans rights-oriented”.
He disclosed that the exchange with the roommate then began to explore a motive.
“Roommate: ‘Why?’ Robinson: ‘Why did I do it?’ Roommate: ‘Yeah."’ Robinson: ‘I had enough of his hatred. Some hate can’t be negotiated out. If I am able to grab my rifle unseen, I will have left no evidence. Going to attempt to retrieve it again, hopefully they have moved on. I haven’t seen anything about them finding it,’” Gray said.
I think the motivation is pretty clear at this point. Not sure how this post got 1k+ likes and no one seem to give credible source.
Source: https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/sep/16/charlie-kirk-shooting-prosecutor-utah
My sentiment is the same.
To be blunt, Lemmy is a terrible place to ask.
The politicians just want to continue spreading fear no matter the side imo. I hate how they want to argue instead of trying to unify us (which is what they seem scared to do cuz a unified nation will turn against them)
That is utter bullshit. The right is wanting to go door to door and kill democrats and keep saying this is war. The left is saying we dont condone this kind of abhorrent behavior. They are NOT the same at all.
The oligarchs want that, and the oligarchs have many politicians in their pocket I presume. However, it’s not like non-corrupt non-bought politicians have any reason to be afraid of a unified nation – they’re in politics to effect change in the first place.
Ik just feels like they don’t care. Overall I just hate all this in fighting makes it hard to get stuff done when you point fingers and shit
yeah, I agree. But like, pointing fingers at “politicians” broadly speaking is still just pointing fingers.
Yeahhhhh explaining stuff isn’t my specialty I always end up explaining things wrong lol it’s a bad habit
I heard there is video of him using a megaphone to debate Charlie at some point. I do not know where to verify this. I will be looking into it later.
Is it this one? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rncUo1Pnqio
Close enough to double take, but I don’t think its the person they caught.
Kirk’s job was literally to argue like this though, so it might be somewhere else.
Anyone that’s read about the lead-up to WW2 or, well, any historical instance of fascism gaining political control over a country knows that they’re going to keep pushing. They’re going to keep targeting the left. They’re going to ram through executive orders to oppress the left. They’re going to get the SC to make decisions against the left. They’re going to label nebulous entities like ANTIFA (when’s the last time you saw an ANTIFA gathering) as terrorist organizations. They’re going to end up openly calling for genocide. It’s going to happen.
So I implore everyone to arm themselves and form networks with likeminded people. You do not want to start doing this after it’s too late. If you need motivation, start reading up on 1930s Germany (the similarities are undeniable) and follow up with a list of WW2 atrocities. There’s definitely a WIKI page for it.
The number of similarities between modern America and 1930s Germany is shocking.
I believe the assassination of Kirk is highly analogous to the killing of Horst Wessel. Both Wessel and Kirk were far right nationalists who were killed and subsequently hailed as martyrs by their fascist movements.
Hitler brought up Wessel in all of his early speeches. The Nazis wrote songs and bullt statues of Wessel. And today we can already hear the songs about Kirk. Congressmen are passing around a bill to erect a statue of Kirk in the Capitol.
If we continue to follow this timeline closely, we are about 2 years away from our own Reichstag fire moment.
So this time around, is that 2 weeks?
That’s an interesting subject, I sometimes wonder “is our fascism progressing faster than the Nazis?”, but I haven’t really come up with a good answer.
I’ll stick with my “2 years” prediction though. I think a Reichstag fire moment is most likely when political tension is high, and political tension naturally peaks in the lead up to a presidential election.
Think that’s a fair assessment. On the one hand we are more connected than ever and sentiment travels fast and echo chambers let dangerous extremist thought fester. On the other hand, Germans were experiencing just a much worse actual living situation.
This is the most fucking American liberal comment thread. Just casually wondering if it will be years or months until the fascists consolidate power and start exterminating people. Gee, how awful that will be. Sure is a shame nobody can do anything about it.
To be fair, 1930s got most of their ideas from the US. The country has always been sick in the bones.
Antifa is such a strange concept to me because doesn’t it stand for Anti-fascist? So making Antifa your enemy means you are fascist
Imperial Japan is the only country in modern history to become a Fascist Theocracy. Under Project 2025, the USA is following a similar path. I always pointed to Germany, Italy and Spain, but they did not beat the Japanese in the fucked up realm of fascism.
Could you elaborate?
Arte, French media, produced a documentary about the Japanese invasion and occupation of Manchuria. Basically WW II started in 1931 led by a rather unknown Imperial Army officer named Kanji Ishiwara. The Tokyo Trials failed to send the asswipe to a prison or hang him and he croaked peacefully in 1949.
they love antifa because they can point at anything they don’t like and scream antifa, and now law enforcement will fall on it.
fucking fascists.
Cut the ‘deep down they know’ bullshit. They have no principles and sincerely believe that it is their opposition, or perceived opposition, that are responsible for all things that go wrong no matter what. No matter how many people Trump fucks over or have their lives completely ruined by him, they will just blame the democrats or transgender people or homosexuals or whoever else. They genuinely cannot see what Trump and his asskissers are doing and the results it is having.
It’s more accurate to think of them as irrational beings with brain disease making them unable to think clearly. They have vague intuitions and a complete inability to think rationally.
He should not have been shot. The shooter was, like virtually all such people, a narcissistic main character sociopath who only cared about his own fame and notoriety, and was likely spending too much time in the damp and mushroomy corners of the internet instead of developing an actual personality in the real world. He’s less an anti-fascist soldier and more a Travis Bickle wannabe wanker.
But Charlie Kirk was a humongous piece of shit and I am glad he’s dead. One fewer humongous pieces of shit to have to listen to. I would never advocate the murder of a man like him, and like I said, I think the shooter was a colossal cunt who unleashed way more danger and harm to marginalised groups than Kirk was capable of provoking on his own. But thank fuck he’s gone. Silver linings n’all that 🤷
I’m glad he’s gone but this is just what the right needs to go full force Nazi as we have rightly known since it occurred.
They were going to do that anyway. And something like this was pretty much inevitable with the way Trump’s been running things. It’s all part of the plan.
We can agree that the right wing is trying to use Kirk’s death as casus belli to start a civil war against us. We are in a dangerous position right now.
But at the same time we can also choose to NOT spread misinformation like this. No, we don’t know right now what political leaning the killer has. If anything, if the evidences released by the investigation can be trusted, he is more likely to be left leaning.
Yes, the right spreads misinformation all the time to further their goals. But I think we can do better.
What evidence? So far, none of it says he is a left winger. Everything we do know points to a MAGA family and village of similar idiots with violent tendencies and a gun-loving way of life.
First of all, you completely missed the main point of my comment. If you think there’s no evidence then you shouldn’t be claiming one way or the other either, yet this post is presenting him as definitively right wing.
Secondly, I didn’t say he is a left winger. I said (based on my judgement) the evidence shows he probably, maybe leans left.
And answering your “what evidence” question, his text message to his roommate is released by the investigation. There are also statement from his mother stating he is “getting more and more left” (obviously, grains of salt). And there are leaked (released?) Discord messages from the killer.
If you never heard any of these, then you probably are in an echo chamber.
I didn’t miss it. I ignored it the same way you so vociferously try to pull this rightwinger away from his rightwing history.
Huh? That wasn’t what I was doing at all, you just pulled that accusation out of your ass. You asked me “what evidence”, so I answered, I guess that was the wrong thing to do.
So you actively ignore evidence that might be inconvenient to your opinions?
Ok.
Oh, so a bad faith argument
No. I chose to ignore apologist language. Seems quite unpopular with those using words to annoy instead of communicate.
Which is, indeed, a bad faith argument.
Also, answering their comments is not ignoring.
Ok.
“I had enough of his hatred. Some hate can’t be negotiated out.”
Robinson’s mother explained that over the last year or so, Robinson had become more political and had started to lean more to the left, becoming more pro–gay and trans–rights oriented. She stated that Robinson began to date his roommate, a biological male who was transitioning genders. This resulted in several discussions with family members, especially between Robinson and his father, who had very different political views.
You people are fucking dipshits.
Right. MAGA never go for self-preservation against rightwing retaliation.
Put the pieces together. Aside from what I already said:
-Estranged from right wing family
-Dating a transwoman
-Struggled with gender identity
-Complaining about hatred
None of these things are characteristic of the right.
Balance that against an entire life of rightwing indoctrination. That’s a rightwing kid with mental issues.
I will not concede this bullshit talking point that “the left” did this when we all have eyes.
Balance that against an entire life of rightwing indoctrination.
You are describing probably 80% of liberals. Political opinion is not genetic.
Killing someone for “spreading hate” is not a right wing phenomenon.
Lol. That’s a hell of a stretch. You’re welcome to keep pushing this line while I roll my eyes and ignore it.
Specifically what evidence released by the investigation do you feel characterizes the alleged killer as left-leaning? I have not seen any such evidence.
Everyone spreads misinformation to further their goals. It’s just not so obvious when it’s your side doing it. Confirmation bias
It’s not just the political right
All that a German needs to know about this incident is two words:
Reichstag Fire
(EU pls send help 🥺👉👈)
I can’t speak to the shooter’s motivations (though meme forensics seems pretty silly) but the “at a Right wing state with a Right wing governor” etc bits seem pretty dumb.
It’d be like saying the guy who went after Pelosi was clearly a Leftie because it was in a Leftie state, with a Left song governor, in a Left wing city against a Left wing politician. Pretty nonsense points and make us look dumb.
It’s sort of relevant because when crazy stuff happens in a Democratic state, the right points fingers and they imply that chaos is happening because of governance.
Kind of feels like the right invents their own truth and constantly does mental gymnastics. Now we are doing it? The media talked about goypher for a day and everybody jumped on it.
How are “we” doing mental gymnastics here?
Thinking this guy is right wing just because his dad is and assuming he “ironically” wrote an anti fascist song lyric on the bullet.
The media mentioned goypher once and everyone jumped on the band wagon without asking any questions.
At least the CIA nipped this Luigi before it could grow.
jumping on the band wagon without any questions… like the whole trans rhetoric on a bullet. the bullets engravings are memes and I doubt there was much thought put into them beyond being ‘for the lulz’ or some other edgelord bullshit as would be expected of a 4channer
That’s a bit my point, both sides are exhibiting the same energy at the moment. I thought Lemmy would be a bit more critical, especially since I figure it’s users are more resistant to rhetoric and manipulation.
At this point, I think even if the shooter came out and publicly declared his ideology, anybody that “guessed” wrong during the last week wouldn’t believe him.
Seems blatant to me, I’m surprised no one seems to be mentioning it.
Interesting. I hadn’t even considered that.
As far as I’ve been able to figure out, the kid was neither right nor left, just fucked in the head.
Exactly, that’s why I hate politics they just like to politicize everything. Even if he was left or right instead of fighting we should focus on the mental health epidemic(I believe that’s the right word).
It’s like how people sue gun companies for shootings instead of thinking the person who did the shooting is mentally ill
… Politicize everything? A guy killed a political figure for political purposes at a literal rally.
My bad, what I actually meant was politicizing to fit their narrative. As tragic as this event was the right and left are just pointing fingers at each other which doesn’t help things.
Oh ya, the right famously doesn’t point fingers at every point in time, while calling to kill left leaning people.
They now claim he was “left leaning”. It’s a war of propaganda.
They were always going to blame it on the left. Facts don’t matter to rightists, only keeping control of their followers. All of Lemmy called it the moment the assassination happened.
His mom literally said that her son shifted left and got into arguments with his father about politics. How does it feel to be on the side of lies and disinformation?
I see your account is brand new. Whether you’re a Russian or Chinese operative, a MAGA propagandist, or just extremely gullible, the Fediverse is probably not the place for you.
I’m gullible because I am trusting his mother’s statement over your conspiracy theory? Lol ok.
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Robinson’s mother told police that her son had “began to date his roommate, a biological male who was transitioning genders,” the court document said.
And she said that over the past year or so, Robinson had become more political and had “started to lean more to the left – becoming more pro-gay and trans-rights oriented,” according to the documents.
Likely based on his texts with his transwoman roommate.
First of all, there is no Republican Party any longer, they are as dead as the Whigs. They should only be referred to in an historical or scholarly context.
They are the MAGA Party now. They have nothing in common with the traditional platform of the Republican Party - smaller government, lower taxes, economic/fiscal responsibility, family values, religious values, etc. MAGA embraces none of those foundational tenets, instead supporting and encouraging treason, racism, corruption, violence, genocide, pedophilia, misogyny, incompetence, ignorance, intolerance, and more.
The Dems should hold a press conference, and unilaterally, but officially, declare the death of the Republican Party, and then never refer to them again, always calling them the MAGA Party. The MAGAs are proud of being Republicans, and they will go out of their minds over this.
the traditional platform of the Republican Party - smaller government, lower taxes, economic/fiscal responsibility, family values, religious values, etc.
TBF, the GOP didn’t hold many of those values either. They wanted to increase government control over people, lower taxes only for the rich and therefore increase the national debt, values only counted if they were christian and straight, etc. The main differences with MAGA is they say the quiet part out loud and they’re more comfortable with nazis, fascists, and kings than the GOP ostensibly was.
They may not have lived by it, but they certainly were proud of it, and claimed it relentlessly. Now they don’t even try to claim smaller government, or lower taxes. They know how ludicrous it would sound.
They are the MAGA Party now. They have nothing in common with the traditional platform of the Republican Party - smaller government, lower taxes, economic/fiscal responsibility, family values, religious values, etc.
What a load of bullshit. The Republican party has never, in my lifetime (and from everything I’ve read, since long before that) stood for those things.
They may have said that they do, but their actions speak louder than words.
I honestly cannot believe that people still say shit like this.
Whether they lived by it or not, it was the definition of their party that they offered to the world.
The fact that they don’t even try to float those concepts any more, because they know how silly they’d sound, demonstrates that they have changed.
The simple fact is that the Republican Party and the MAGA Party are now two separate entities, and should be referred to that way. And by the Dems making the unilateral choice to eject the Republicans to the dustbin of history, and force recognition of the MAGA Party, the Traditional Republicans, who think they are going to wait out MAGA, and revert to being Republicans again someday, will come to the realization that they have killed the Republican Party that they love so much.
It’s long past time that the Dems matched the MAGA’s psychological warfare.
His Mom said he had become more political lately. Specifically left-leaning, pro-gay and pro-trans. He left a note for his trans roommate that he was going to assassinate Kirk. He said that he “Had enough of Kirks hatred” in his discord chat and inscribed pro-trans, gay and antifascist rhetoric on the bullets.
How is any of this right wing?
Being pro-gay and protrans doesn’t necessarily mean that you’re not right-wing. It just means you don’t share the commonly held out groups. Unusual, yes, but a tell, not really.
If he was dropping some Marxist stuff, was interested in taxing the rich, or universal healthcare, then I would say he’s not right wing.
So how do you know he’s right wing?
Edit: Also how do address the hate comment? And justify him killing Kirk for not being far-right enough?
I don’t. I don’t really think the information points to a specific ideology at this point in time. I’d give the odds of them being conservative about 65%. He was born and raised in a Christian conservative family. In a religious conservative state. Gay hate can only really exist in an environment without gay people, same thing for people who hate trans people.
Which hate comment are you talking about? I am not familiar, so this might change my opinion.
As for not being far right enough, that’s easy. The online and professional media have been playing the game of who can be more extreme for a while now. I believe there’s a lot of conservatives out there who would be willing to kill someone on their same side for not being extreme enough. They would consider them traders, grifters, or not real conservatives.
He was born and raised in a Christian conservative family. In a religious conservative state.
The origin story of many gay people or future political leftists.
Gay hate can only really exist in an environment without gay people, same thing for people who hate trans people.
Assertion. It’s like saying you can’t hate men unless you grow up in a society without them. People hate all kinds of people for all kinds of reason. This argument doesn’t work.
Which hate comment are you talking about?
He said Kirk was spreading hate.
I believe there’s a lot of conservatives out there who would be willing to kill someone on their same side for not being extreme enough.
What you believe has nothing to do with what is true. There is no evidence that he thought Kirk wasnt extreme enough. In fact his hate comment indicates it could be the opposite. (e.g. that he saw Kirk as a Nazi that needed to be killed)
Holy poop you are coming on wrong and hard. I don’t know if the shooter conservative or not, but you desperately don’t want him to be. Probably because it would look bad for you if he was.
You’re not interested in the truth, just a narrative.
I’m challenging the certainty of this entire site. My personal opinion is that he is a broken product of a nihilistic culture. I also think that he hated Charlie because he thought Charlie hated gays even though he was a big tent conservative that was inclusive for all. What people don’t understand is that Kirk WAS the moderate conservative.
Kirk was definitionally a fascist.
As for what the shooter is, I’m sure time will tell. I don’t see a need to jump to conclusions on that yet.
~~Kirk was definitionally a fascist.
As for what the shooter is, I’m sure time will tell. I don’t see a need to jump to conclusions on that yet.~~
Edit: duplicate post due to lag. Please ignore
To a Nazi, anything less than pure, unadulterated Nazism is “left-leaning”.
You could be characterized the same way.
No, not really, I mean some tankies out there are like that, but then again if your logic is on the level of tankies you’re most likely wrong. A right wing shooter killed Kirk, that’s just a fact.
that’s just a fact
Should be easy for you to prove beyond any shadow of a doubt right now then.
So, far right parents in a conservative religion in a Republican town in a Republican state produced a child so tortured by a culture of hate and violence that as soon as they even start to lean either way their instinct is murder. Breaking the cycle of hate is relatively easy compared to breaking the cycle of violence. The statements they made to their roommate (even if that heresay is true) just confirm that they were a troubled child from a troubled culture trying to change. It should surprise no one that those childish attempts would be a VERY twisted reflection of the ideal. So no, he was not part of the left. Just a child in pain reacting the only way their conservative upbringing taught them.
No true scotsman. Being against ideas of the right and killing someone for espousing them ipso facto is left wing.
What is the difference between center-right, right and far right in your view?
Can we get a link from The associate press or Reuters and not a British tabloid.
Parents said their son became more political
While authorities say Robinson hasn’t been cooperating with investigators, they say his family and friends have been talking.
Robinson’s mother told investigators that their son had turned left politically in the last year and became more supportive of gay and transgender rights after dating someone who is transgender, Gray said.
Those decisions prompted several conversations in the household, especially between Robinson and his father. They had different political views and Robinson told his partner in a text that his dad had become a “diehard MAGA” since Trump was elected.
Mason added that the family’s views “differed quite significantly,” and the conversations were at times controversial between parents and son.
Thank you.
You can actually. I suggest using this website: www.google.com
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There are also plenty (arguably way more) that are lefties that hate Trump’s guts. What’s your point?
