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The video mostly goes into if the act is performative or not. The thesis is primarily that protest doesn’t work, but that non-violent direct action does work. The goal is to gum up the works.
this is what im gonna say about protest. talk to protesters. view it as a god damn meet and greet. if you have plans share them. stop being some incel loser that wants everyone to stay home and be anti social
What do you mean protest doesn’t work!? The No Kings protest was the biggest in history and Trump is still doing what he wants!
… wait
Defeatists can take a walk.
Delusional copers can walk with them.
Have fun crying into the wind while others get actual progress done.
Huge protests make it known that we’re not alone. That’s an important first step, even if BeenPedo Mussolini doesn’t give a shit
Don’t let it stay at the petty demonstration level, is my point. It WILL take more than protest.
Far, far more than protest.
Agreed. But my point is that it’s not useless. It’s just Step 1.
I’m not seeing anyone moving past step 1, yet.
You plan to get “actual progress” done all by yourself, then? You feel the need to dump on people who agree with your motives and your reasons, because why? They’re not “actual progress” enough for you? They’re not pure enough for you?
How about you cheer on people who are standing up against the tyranny too? no matter how “actual progress” you think their effort isn’t. We’re talking about parents and grandparents, not frigging Che Guevara.
Protest is masturbation.
I think we can probably manage more compassion for the people looking for ways to engage with the problems we care about than this thread has generally demonstrated. (Which to be fair is a criticism not directly aimed at just you)
Protest is really good for making people feel connected to eachother when everything sucks. Its really good at demonstrating to people in your community that you care about then and wish for then to be safe. Its good at keeping us afloat emotionally when fascism wishes for us to sink and give in to despair. And its a really good way to get involved, meet other people, and get comfortable with political action.
Even if you dont think it works to solve the problem directly it has several invaluable functions for making it through this mess. “Protest is a good start, from there try to get involved in organizing in your community and take direct political action” is a perfectly valid statement, and much better praxis in the way we treat people than “dont protest, its a waste of time”
the reality is most people have never protested, OR organized, OR taken direct political action to gum up the works. If they start with protest, GOOD. Anything that gets people out in the streets doing something. Hell, they can start with just meeting their neighbors.
The “protest is masturbation” approach to discussing things with your fellow leftists is why half this thread is people being sarcastic, insulting eachother, and generally being interpersonally dysfunctional instead of having a discussion as allies. Their bad behavior isnt your fault, but I think we can all maybe try to engage with eachother in a way that gets peoples best selves in return, if we wanna be able to accomplish any of our goals.
Again, this isnt really a strictly you issue. But man is it frustrating to watch this play out over and over and over. We consistently prioritize being right or worse still, dunking on the other guy, instead of trying to build consensus and effective political coalition
No.
Protest is masturbation, in the sense that it is a relief value for a pent-up frustration, that otherwise without an exhaust value, would result in more extreme actions. Its like electing Democrats. Symbolic, ultimately worthless, and because of its existence, an actually effective solution isn’t able to manifest.
Protest relieves the pressure but does nothing.
The way you’re engaging with this person is bad praxis.
Theyre doing their best to find ways to engage with the problem, and while I can empathize with the fact that the way they’re treating you is overtly combative, the fascists win when we engage with eachother in this way.
If we want to succeed at our goals its more important to build political coalition and consensus than to be right and score points on the guy with the bad take. Let’s put our best foot forward and engage with eachother in a way that helps us accomplish our goals
I am still wholly correct in pointing out how protest is not the be-all end-all answer. When someone obstinately clings to something just as ineffective as complaining on the internet, their ideology becomes incompatible with solutions.
I totally agree that protest is not the end all be all. And at the same time, their ideology isnt rectified by this interpersonal behavior. Theyre your ally. They sit right next to you on the political spectrum. If you can’t build political coalition with them, who can you?
Its not enough to be right. Its REALLY important to have functional conversations with eachother so that we can get as many people engaged and taking the highest impact action they can. And I dont think this way of engaging with eachother achieves that. I dont think fascists or the power structures we’re unhappy about are threatened by us tearing eachother down
I think even just saying “I really dont think protest is the end all be all, I feel like we should be focusing on things that have a bigger impact, here’s why: …” would be a lot more effective at creating productive conversation among leftists. Thats what you said to me, and I think that’s a totally sensible position we should be discussing
The way you’re engaging with this person is bad praxis.
If you’re willing to look past the bristly sarcasm and the condescension it carries its clear theyre hurting and trying to figure out how to cope just like all the rest of us in this mess.
The fascists win when we engage with eachother like this. I also dont appreciate the defeatism, but let’s find a little empathy for those among us for whom the weight of our current reality has gotten the better of them.
yeah I agree with doing this and fuck anyone else that has an issue with it. also you’re free to express better courses of action
To my understanding, eesearch has generally found that peaceful protest also works, generally in achieving different ends. You know what else works? All maner of other forms of political organizing. Its what got mamdani elected.
No need to present protest as ineffective, it’s a great way to get your foot in the door, start getting comfortable with these things, connect with other people, and attend to your mental health by building solidarity and feeling engaged with the issues you care about.
Whatever gets you offline and taking action is a good thing. Start with a protest. Start with going to a local meeting for a political org. Start with joining your local ICE watch.
The important thing is that you get offline and get involved with other people. Start.
To my understanding, eesearch has generally found that peaceful protest also works, generally in achieving different ends. You know what else works? All maner of other forms of political organizing. Its what got mamdani elected.
One single paper based made this argument, and like a brainworm, it took over the narrative.
