Congratulation to Melat Kiros, this just proves what I’ve so often claimed here on Lemmy.
That the best bet for change, is to become a member of the Democratic party, and help change it from within.If only more young people saw this reality rather than the moronic:
“DEMS BAD! LET DEMS LOSE TO FASCIST TO TEACH DEMS LESSON! OH WAIT, WHY ARE WE NOW COMMITTING 500 MORE GENOCIDES AND NO LONGER HAVE FAIR ELECTIONS?”
Nobody is saying that, they’re saying to set a minimum standard to vote democrat so that candidates like this get elected. This is where they gloat and say they were right.
My dude, they are saying this shit and this is why we’re in the boat we are in.
Young people historically haven’t been showing up to primaries. They’re not putting in the effort to get a candidate worth voting for.
So you’re left with 2 options:
- Shitty damage mitigation candidate
- The new Nazi party
The system favors the new Nazi party, so yes, inaction and voting 3rd party is objectively supporting the new Nazi party.
inaction is, but voting third party allows strategy adjustment based on exit polling and what third parties got votes, which does actually shift things left.
Objectively wrong.
In the US presidential election system, the Electoral College forces a maximum of 2 viable parties, and nothing else. It also favors Republicans as it gives them more value per received vote, meaning the Dems need to get more votes than Republicans to win each election, and even then it may not be enough like in 2016.
So when you vote for a 3rd party candidate, not only are you again supporting the GOP’s victory, you are also allowing them to move the Overton window further right, which is exactly what’s been happening.
The only thing that has successfully moved the Overton winfow left, in the US, is voting in Dem Socs in DNC primaries, and voting against the GOP candidate no matter what in general elections.
Even if your Dem politician is a neo-liberal, voting them in is a SIGNIFICANT slowdown of shifting the Overton window right than by letting the Republican win.
You did not respond to anything I actually said and instead made a stock post.
voting for 3rd parties that are, for example socialist, shows dems what people are voting against them for. It’s true that this favors the gop, that cost is sometimes worth it to shift the dems farther left. If polls show a milquetoast stance on gaza doesn’t get you elected… I believe politicians losing over israel for example is why the dems are being pushed left.
i never said the third party stands a chance.
Have you tried learning basic arithmetic?
I don’t see your point and you seem needlessly rude
Electoral college
Not voting only tells candidates that you’re not a reliable voter, so they can ignore you. They don’t see your non-vote as a protest vote, because failing to vote means you don’t exist to them. If you want to exist to politicians you have to vote. Also, there are nearly always down ballot candidates that are progressive that get ignored because morons act like the top of the ticket is the only reason to leave their moms basement.
Think of it from the perspective of a candidate, they have endless data showing them that no matter how hard they try they won’t meet your moral purity test, so they court reliable voters with their messaging and resources.
Most politicians are not reliable so people lose hope and stop voting yet people like you keep critisizing the voters and not the politicians
Oh I am far more angry at the Dem party. Not voting is still moronic.
Moronic or not, you make them vote by pressuring the politicians. Shaming them will not improve the chance of them starting voting again.
Sure and work right past them by electing progressives and DSA members.
But for non voters i fear we can shame them, worship them, do everything they want and it still wont matter. They don’t vote because it makes them feel superior. Its not about politics, its about needing to feel justified in their belief that they are better. It’s just ego. Others are just myopic and act helpless. Until they start getting marched into camps, then they might start to see why voting always matters.
I’ve watched it over and over, a candidate will agree with someone on 99% of issues, finally a candidate these voters can get behind. Most of those non voters still stay home. They’ll find one issue they disagree with, or they’ll say it doesn’t matter anyway, that every candidate is controlled opposition. I’ve worked in politics, I’ve seen the data, I’ve courted those voters. Until non voters actually show up, mocking them is probably just as good a use of time as any (I’m maybe being flippant here).
Inaction is nearly as big an evil in society as bad action.
This is a democracy. Are you saying the voters deserve no criticism when we end up with Republicans?
Shitty establishememt democratic politicians gave you trump . Yes in democracies politicians are the one who should get critisized
How did they give us Donvict? Donvict was and is clearly a reaction - an all-too-predictable one, by they way - from reactionaries that had their brains utterly broken by having a black President for 8 years.
I don’t see how it makes any sense to go all Murc’s Law on Democratic candidates, but the voters, most especially Republican voters and non-voters, are blameless?
They have data showing people don’t vote for them if they aren’t properly aligned with them on issues like israel. They then the one that tries to appeal to those things gets elected. Based on what you’re saying there’s essentially no point at all to voting or appealing to you, because you’ll vote for them no matter what. There’s only a reason to appeal to people if what you do changes whether they vote for you.
You’re whole argument is a series of straw mans and doesn’t actually address what I said. You can literally go in and vote for no one or only one down ballot candidate you believe in and that would be far more productive than not voting. I could be the most left wing candidate that ever lived and courting non voters would still be a waste in most elections. How are you going to convince me that courting someone that has voted in last 4 elections is less important than courting someone who skipped the last 4? If you don’t vote, you’ve announced to the world you don’t care and the world responded as expected.
And exit polling doesn’t exist for non voters if they don’t vote… Who are these mythical people who never vote but we have mountains of data on. The primary way parties get data is through voter rolls and party affiliation that they cross reference with purchased metadata. If your not voting they have a choice between targeting reliable voters they know support them and complete mysteries that never vote, be real here.
You’re right. I forgot third parties were even an option. My bad.
@communist @HazardousBanjo Where were you during the last election? Because, yeah, there were plenty of folks who were saying exactly that. Remember 2016 when Susan Sarandon said exactly that?
Losing affordable healthcare, and funneling even more wealth to the 1%, while making the economy worse both for working people and the country.
If only it was just confined to the very young. Lots of people remember some of the idiotic things they said before and just as they came of age to vote. Many people continued to cling to it, however.
Not that Adam Mockler falls prey to this kind of thing, but I watch his feed, and one thing I’ve noticed younger folks like him tend to do, and man, does it make me cringe - it’s when they use a sentence with the phrase “my generation…”. Oof.
I guess it takes a few more years to get some real perspective on just how silly that sounds to talk about your “generation” as if it’s somehow magically different than any other, but one way to try to explain this to someone that is Gen X or younger and has not yet picked up on this: boomers have a song, practically an anthem for the boomers, at least at one point in time: “My Generation”. It even had the lyrics:
“I hope I die before I get old (Talkin’ 'bout my generation)”
LOL. BTW, this is not confined to any given generation, hell, my generation - Gen X - did the same shit in their tweens, teens, twenties, thirties.
That’s because the young people are dumb as shit unfortunately (I’m a young person). Internet has destroyed our brains and the ability to have social interaction, much easier to develop an apathy for politics. My friend group is pretty leftist so naturally I was somewhat surprised to see the apathy of people my age when I moved to a place with more people even in a pretty liberal city. Heck even those who say they are “liberal” have some baffling takes. One girl said to me “well I can afford the cost of inflation right now so why do I care what’s happening with increasing prices” and I was just dumbfounded at the shortsightedness and also lack of caring for others who can’t.
As a side anecdote it’s pretty depressing how going to a grocery store line in the city no less there’s just giant lines of people waiting for self checkout because people don’t wanna talk to cashiers lol despite those lines being way shorter. I think it’s part of the overall culture that leads to this “eh fuck it imma head out” stuff. I don’t even think it’s majority the “let’s spite the dems” crew.
At least while FPTP is still the main system of election in the US.
Yes, and Republicans will do absolutely zero to change that, because abusing the system is one of their main strategies.
And old school Democrats won’t change it either for some reason, despite calling themselves democrats.
So it’s a long process of first changing the Democratic party from within, and then hopefully get the power to modernize democracy in USA.old school Democrats won’t change it either for some reason
Because the ratchet effect will stop working when they’re no longer able to buy primaries and then run as the only realistic alternative to fascism.
The current system protects the DNC from losing power to the effectively disenfranchised Left more than anything else.
The ratchet effect is non-voters doing jack shit to clean things up while the sycophants continue to get their way. Cant blame the Dems for that one.
Why do you think you hear so many ‘Leftists’ screaming Both Sides Are The Same?
Nonvoting always helps the Right, because those guys go to the polls every chance they get.
Tbf they are kind of the only ones who know what they are voting for, and are getting what they are voting for. And that’s rich daddy gets all the power.
I think it was Chris Rock who said nobody works harder than a crack addict.
Same mentality
This is so sad IMO, because it’s probably true.
Shedding a tear for the country I once admired. 😥
https://www.vote.nyc/RankedChoiceVoting
New York City, long a Dem stronghold, has implemented ranked choice voting.
The best bet for change is to run a democratic socialist platform with the local DSA community
Running as independent may be advantageous in some races
It’s only the best bet for change short-term. Long-term a two-party system will never work. It might lead to great improvements in the months or years to come, but the same issues are bound to return in decades if the system is not reformed.
It’s only the best bet for change short-term. Long-term a two-party system will never work.
I agree, but the point is exactly on the long term to make changes to democracy. But that’s not possible without representation.
Joining a third party will never achieve anything. So the only alternative to influence the Democratic party from within is civil war as I see it.
How TF do you have a 29 year incumbent??
Mitch McConnell has been a senator in Kentucky for 41 years. Its ridiculous that there are no term limits for these people.
There has never been a moment of my life he hasn’t cast a shadow over. I’m gonna need a few hospitals after celebrating
Term limits should be something carried out at the ballot box.
*was. Tbc.
MF love boomers. Our governor was a strong 20 year run in office, most your senators have been in Washington since the 80’s-90’s. Yo these people die in their seats of power, thats how…
I suppose it’s the fault of the constituents for continuing to vote the same person in over and over again. Or is it that you don’t have any other choices?
Laziness. And fear of change.
It is not that there are not other possibilities. I don’t really understand how it’s now become fashionable on the left to now grumble and carp about “term limits” and engaging in lots of ageism, but what it is fairly obvious is the people doing the most complaining about it are not involved in running in primaries themselves.
I am also highly dubious of anything magical about term limits or having younger people in office.
In fact, I think it’s a rather obvious red herring to have everyone engage in some good old fashioned divide-n-conquer, this time divided along generational boundaries. In this particular redux, we now have social media to turbo charge things, instead of the boomers vs. the GI and Silent Generations, it’s now Gen Z and Gen Y pitched against boomers. Yawn. I guess it’s as predictable as the tides but the people this is mostly aimed at have not been around long enough to know the game.
The fact that so many seem to be fooled by this, especially on the supposed left? Definitely disappointing.
Something I keep noticing is that many polling places are in the lobbies of nursing homes.
No one’s stopping you from running. The DNC will campaign against you if you are socialist.
Well… The fact that I’m not a US citizen is a massive hurdle, for starters.
Touché. Well, go encourage the young socialist kids to run for Office.
Damn, that Zionist shill had occupied that seat as long as Melat has been alive!
DSA! DSA! DSA!
Ive been seeing this acronym a lot lately, what does it stand for?
Democratic Socialists of America, they are growing fast at the grass roots level.
Excellent!
Shitlibs beware
I was legit excited to vote for her. I’m cautiously optimistic to see how she does.
Even if the new class is a disaster we can vote them out and still fracture the power structure enough to slow it down.
The real travesty hear is that there was a 29-year incumbent in the first place. Congress desperately needs term limits.
hahahahah boy I hope the radical left is as radical and violent as the republicans imagine them to be.
Denver is pretty blue, so I’m not sure I’d be getting out over our skis here.
I hope they can pull it off in November. That word “socialist” is like Pavlov’s bell, triggering the average American to vote Republican.
They are in safe seats so far. I don’t think it would make a difference.
There isn’t going to be an election in November. Wake up.
