I know I’m not the only one who feels like I’m getting visually assaulted everytime I drive at night. It was bad 10 years ago but now, it seems like headlight manufacturers have a deal with insurance companies and optometrists to make the lights as bright as possible. Is this ever going to stop or is there some kind of race in the headlight industry to see who can reproduce the power of the sun first?
In Canada, the federal government just put out a nationwide poll for input on this exact subject, as it’s coming near to the time to review the related legislation. It’s very possible that some of the headlight implementations currently on the road will soon be illegal nationwide.
Thank god, I’ve been sick of this shit for over a decade. I don’t know who would vote against dimmer lights. Do you have a link for this poll?
The poll closed 20 April: https://tc.canada.ca/en/corporate-services/consultations/canadian-experience-vehicle-headlights-glare-night
I seem to recall it opened in February. There were lots of news articles on Lemmy about it at the time.
In regional areas the extra light at night is genuinely helpful.
However, thats on unlit roads with so little traffic that you only see an oncoming car once every 5 or 10 minutes.
On roads with more traffic theyre just not necessary because there aren’t any animals or other obstacles.
In regional areas the extra light at night is genuinely helpful.
Bro, that’s what the high beams are for.
The current situation is the normal (low beam) headlights on some “newer” cars are so bright, I could turn of my headlights at night and the car behind me gives enough light for me to see without a problem.
Oh I thought thats what everyone was complaining about.
Everyone here has after market LED light bars or spot lights. Factory lights and evern high beams are no big thing but light bars have the fire of a thousand suns.
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Trucks with 3 sets of LED lights blinding me all the time
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Because consumer protection and regulation seems to have stopped being a real thing after Reagan. Since then everything good has been legacy agencies patching at the edges where they had authority (all gone now thanks to the Supreme Court - see Loper Bright Enterprises v. Raimondo).
Buckle up. It’s only going to get worse.
(This is extra ironic because buckling up is only even a thing because of consumer protections. So I guess get ready to be thrown through a windshield.)
its just so american to only think in a timeline of presidents :) always gets me
i guess adaptive headlights were also invented by reagan
My apologies.
Deregulation happened completely randomly in a vacuum like a decaying lump of a radioactive element with no cause.
In all seriousness though… yes, ALL changes happen in a sea of social, economic, and political factors, but someone pulls the trigger, and it’s fair to point at the gunman.
Adaptive headlights only recently became legal in the US.
That’s because a significant amount of the regulatory agency leadership is appointed by the executive and follows their policy priorities?
Your overlord’s president is also your president
This is a US and Canada problem. This is basically a non-issue in the rest of the world.
There are two standards for headlights, one established by the UN that applies to 99% of countries. Whereas the US and Canada have the other standard that is far worse for glare.
The global standard has strict rules on glare, requiring a sharp cutoff line at the top of the beam. The american regulations do not have this. American regulations do not account for headlight height off the ground, defining alignment purely with angles. An SUV or pickup with its headlights mounted above your eyeline can legslly shine the fullest part of its lights directly into your eyes at all times. In contrast, the international regulations account for height, and require tall vehicles to incline their headlights further downward to avoid dazzling other drivers.
This problem can be solved for new cars instantly by switching to the international standard. The auto industry is international. They sell in markets with the global standard and could switch their headlights immediately after a change in the law. This is an easily solvable problem.
If you’re saying that it’s not a problem in Europe then I can’t imagine how bad it is in America. I get blinded by taller vehicles all the time on the road in Denmark. I also don’t think most people’s automatic high beams work correctly.
Bad like turning down the rear view mirror, covering the side view with my hand, and then asking a passenger to cover the other side view. Then still having a cabin full, and I mean evening reading under a tree full, of light.
Bad like deciding to pick one single line or marker, maybe a painted, solid white line that’s right in front of my front passenger wheel, and concentrating on following just that one line for the whole duration that the truck is headed towards me in the other lane. Because I can’t see anything if I’m just looking around. I need to concentrate on one thing to be able to decipher the image.
And my eyes are great otherwise. I have perfect color perception. I prefer to hike at night without any light, even if it’s moonless. This shit is just out of control. The stuff coming from the factories is bad enough, but these magats who make their vehicles intentionally harmful to others in every way they can, really make driving extremely dangerous for everyone.
a painted, solid white line that’s right in front of my front passenger wheel
Important technique
It’s gotten so bad in the Netherlands, too. Especially with newer BMWs and Audis. Since both our countries don’t make cars, this probably is true in all of Europe.
It is.
Totally agree. I’ve never even been to the American continent and I feel OP’s question. I wrote a top-level comment further down.
Anyhow:
automatic high beams
This is a thing now?!
I shouldn’t be surprised. The stretch of motorways I use every day has tunnels, and I noticed that many if not most newer cars’ tail lights get brighter inside it. And I’m not imagining this. And it makes no sense when you think about it; if anything, it should be the other way 'round. It’s just more computer-made gimmickry designed to rope in customers.
(Yes, lights need to be on also during daytime in this EU country.)automatic high beams
This is a thing now?!
I think it is in the us. I dont really know if its every car but recent models of even inexpensive cars have it and it works pretty well
I’m all for this - people are idiots and the technology is generally good now
actually I’d go further and mandate active matrix headlights on every new car. People really are self-centered idiots and headlight glare is a real problem. Time for the technology nanny
Time for the technology nanny
We already have that - it’s called vehicle inspection
Thank you for the informative text, but it is definitely a problem in the rest of the world too, at least in Europe. The front lights of cars have gotten too bright for urban settings, and perhaps there are just too many cars around, to the point I have read and heard dozens different people in recent years wondering if it’s just their perception.
Driving a bicycle at night on the side of a road is impossible if you are not equipped as well with a sun in a box.I don’t think this is true anymore. We have standards for headlights with much sharper cutoff and even allow active matrix headlights now. But that won’t help until it’s been true long enough for most cars to have this.
In addition to general asshatedness, there’s definitely a regulation issue.
- many states don’t do annual inspections Much less care about headlights
- how the eff is it legal to sell led headlight inserts that fit standard headlight fixtures, with a wink and a nod that “they’re not intended for headlights”
Because (particularly in the US) people have the attitude of “I know that it’s going to be shit for other people, but it makes me feel a little better about things, so I’m going to do it anyway”
That’s a very complex thought process. Let me unveil the real reason:
“whoah that’s cool”
That’s it. If someone made a pan-nuclear LED with the same brightness as the surface of an entire white dwarf, people would buy it. That’s where the thinking ends. Where the light ends up, other people, etc… Who cares?
“Other people exist?”
Its (like many things) mostly the us’s fault. A slide away from rules into vibe based everything.
I remember a long time ago when I was first getting my license you had to pass a headlight test where you parked in a spot and there where painted lines on a wall for both high and low beams. It was how you adjusted your lights and was common in Canada. Now no one even knows what I am talking about. The rules are still there but no one enforces them and most forgot they can even adjust their lights (not sure new cars and trucks can be anymore).
Manufacturers in North America are now putting their lights so high up on vehicles and use such bright piercing lights on everything that night driving has become a nightmare. The answer to getting blinded is now to out blind others, its madness.
I love that people are asking me if I have some kind of visual deficiency when the phenomenon of blinding lights is so common that it’s in the simpsons from 27 years ago lol
Its gotten to a point that seems impossible, just full clown world. Its gotten to the point that my favorite car to drive at night is my Fiero, because I am so low I am below most of the blinding lights.
And those are “only” halogen. It’s gotten much worse since then. Like you said, a sort of arms race.
I mean they also say “high intensity” which implies HIDs rather than halogens to me, and those require a clear cutoff unlike halogens/incandescents.
It’s also common with European cars, which are much lower and yet have increasingly bright (and bluer?) lights.
The brightness is an issue, but the placement and angle are the bigger problem. Its the slippery slope of following american trends. Years ago Mercedes Benz (I think) put out a car that used IR light and a heads up screen (no visible headlights, just running lights) showing the driver the night landscape without needing to blind everyone. It was banned in the states, no real reason why but the idea went dead.
Without actual headlights I’m certain someone would pull out in front of you, people are dumb
Running lights are a thing, and I see enough people driving with only them at night now.
It was banned in the states
UV scare. They had to use UV lights to make it work. But they weren’t on the same wavelength as say a tanning bed but people made a noise about it anyways.
No IR not UV. Not the same wavelength UV and IR are on the opposite sides of the visual spectrum.
Was it banned in other countries too, or is there some other reason it isn’t used?
Cost, probably
Mercedes put it in the S-Class, their flagship. They can afford fancy extras there.
Makes sense.
Not sure, but the tech is old and tested (almost all cold war era things used IR lights). The issue is I think they can sell the super terrible bright lights as “safety” features. And a lot of consumer trends are american based and just forced on the world.
A German auto company isn’t going to pull a safety feature from the EU, South American, and Asian markets just because it’s banned in the US.
No but they will not also pursue one that is not allowed in the us market as hard. But then again times are a changin.
I think you’re over estimating the amount of influence the US auto market has had.
For me it’s not the brightness, but the color temperature of the light that gets me. Why do we strictly regulate the color of turn signals and brake lights, but not headlights? Warm white should be mandated.
What can any of us do about anything? Everything sucks ass and I have no idea what to do. Should I talk to my literal neo nazi neighbors until I’ve somehow successfully re-educated them? That’s fucking stupid and not possible. The second they turn around from our conversation, they see a television, in their own house, in all the restaurants, in every waiting room in the country, blaring FOX News.
Going over to a Facebook market place pickup, and seeing a dude with Fox just playing in the afternoon on a weekend. I was just like “you really choose to do this in your free time?”. I felt nothing but genuine pity. And I got a pretty cool green enamel sink for free, so I wasn’t about to say anything.
Same reason we just accepted increasingly loud exhausts. Too many selfish idiots on the roads to enforce it effectively.
Same reason we accepted living further and further away from amenities. Cars are a self-reinforcing malady.
Not even the same. LEDs statistically are better for helping light up the roads during the night, and reducing lack of visibility crashes.
https://landline.media/blinded-by-the-light-are-newer-headlights-putting-drivers-at-risk/
No one said loud exhausts or LED lights* cause crashes. They are just annoying to other people. So I would say they are exactly the same.
*we’re not talking about all LED lights here. We’re talking about misaligned and excessively bright LED lights. I’m sure new, modern lights let drivers see better (that’s why they are put in the new cars) but they don’t have to blind other drivers to do that.
I must be taking crazy pills…the title and comment is all about how we just accept this and how manufacturers are racing to make lights as bright as the sun. No where in the comment of this post does it say misaligned.
I’ve read other articles about it the consensus is that the lights are not actually brighter:
https://www.theguardian.com/global/2024/oct/31/headlights-too-bright
“”"Although headlights feel significantly brighter than they used to, Brannon notes that the maximum standards for light output set by the US transportation department’s NHTSA haven’t changed in decades.
Part of the issue, he says, is that the temperature of the light in headlight bulbs has changed.
Experts point out that more drivers are buying bigger cars. Because these cars are taller, their headlights are more likely to shine in the eyes of drivers of smaller cars.
Additionally, many vehicles on the road have misaligned headlights. Over time, the regular wear and tear of driving can jostle headlights out of alignment, meaning the brightest part of the light ends up illuminating areas it’s not supposed to – say, right into an oncoming driver’s eyes.“”"
And this is also my experience. I see a lot of cars with LED lights but few cars in on the roads blind me and when they do they are clearly shining right in my eyes. In Europe huge cars are still not that popular so I’m guessing it’s mostly misalignment, people driving with long beams on or some custom lights that are way brighter than the norm. I have no idea if most people don’t know that they are blinding others or if they don’t care.
Some people are are more sensitive to sharper LED lights and they have bigger problems when driving at night now. In that case properly aligned LED lights are better (and safer) for some, and worst for others.
It seems most people who have issues with the new lights already have vision issues to begin with and would have the same issue with the gold/yellow halogen lights anyways but probably don’t remember. As I can damn near look at the new LEDs and do not get blinded at all by them but the old lights if the vehicle forgot to turn off their brights.
I have much less problem with yellow headlights, and most people mentioning color temp in this thread are expressing as much.
My bike has a yellow headlight and white high beam, which makes it very obvious if I’m flashing someone as opposed to the changes in intensity some headlights have when the reflector is angular.
That’s not what we’re talking about, did you read the title???
It really is, the OP is asking why there isn’t more regulation to stop companies from swapping to the LEDs, and the statistics say that there doesn’t need to be because they’re safer.
This is like asking why they don’t regulate 3 point seatbelts cause it irritates some peoples necks…and we should go back to lap belts.
I know they have gotten brighter over the years but that’s not what’s been the biggest issue for me. To me it’s the fact these trucks keep getting taller, 3 feet ago it wasn’t as bad because the lights were closer to the road, now the headlights on these trucks are damn near eye-level.
Yeah I don’t understand why everyone needs a tank-sized SUV to drive their kids home from school. I’d love to get a small sedan sized truck with a normal car engine but the back is a truck bed, but those are long gone as an option in the states. When I was in Australia I saw these, they call them a ute.
We as a society just accept everything. It’s what we were trained to do. We get mad and make posts like this one, then go back to our daily lives, having changed little to nothing about our behavior or the behavior of others. It’s not necessarily our fault - it’s difficult for one person to make a real change, but that’s just the reality of our society.
But I’m here, commenting! I’m doing my part!
It’s fucking horrible even here in EU, where I would expect it to be better regulated. Can’t imagine how bad it’s in the US.
I’ve even seen multiple posts on local subreddits about people buying SUV/crossovers and one of the main reason was being blinded by other SUVs.
Fucking horrible it should be checked at every MOT, and it sometimes is, but the newer vehicles are exempt from yearly MOTs for some stupid reason.
I didn’t think about it a the time I bought might but that has been a plus to be fair my are stock. Only had a hand full of people putting on their brights back at me. What you going to do.
Adjust your lights to not blind other drivers?
Well that’s no fun at all!
“Only a handful of people indicate to me that I’m being an asshole when I know I’m being an asshole. What are you going to do? I am helpless in this situation.”
These comments make me glad I don’t have to drive at night often.
It pisses me off to no end, but what the fuck can I do about it lol
I’ve often considered making an adjustable mirror with a servo on it mounted to the back of the car, so they can blind themselves and feel stupid
I’ve day dreamed of just wrapping my car in retroreflective vinyl.
I just turn on back fog lights. these are like high beams in a night without fog.
There’s a strong temptation to wander my neighborhood with a thick piece of wood and “solve” my problem locally
Calibrated headlights shouldn’t impair vision too much. Laser (and matrix) headlights are becoming more mainstream too, those gets even brighter but directed. Do you have an astigmatism by chance? Is it aftermarket and modified headlights causing the issue? My pet peeve is lifted trucks running brights behind me. Could be 6 car length back and still light up my interior like a stadium
Poorly aimed headlights are the real killer. They might not even be brights, they’re just aimed to the heavens because people don’t know how to maintain their car.
Well obviously if its a big enough problem to be regulated its not imaginary, and only due to something like alignement
I have light sensitivity, the new lights cause physical pain. I completely stopped driving at night because of them and sometimes have to wear sunglasses at night as a passenger. They’re hell
