• FenrirIII@lemmy.worldEnglish
      11·
      5 days ago

      Boys generally lack role models. It’s all been downhill since we found out that Cosby is a monster.

      • Wren@lemmy.todayEnglish
        5·
        5 days ago

        That’s so weird because guys have freaking batman and superman, presidents, prime ministers, princes, emperors, business leaders, most of hollywood directors, most doctors, and like a million male authors writing about the male perspective while there are women alive today who remember not being able to get a credit card or go into pubs alone. There are women alive today who are legally not allowed to go anywhere alone.

        I’m a millenial who was told I wasn’t allowed to work on cars for a high-school course because it’s “too dirty.” My electronics instructor wouldn’t let me build a circuit board because “the math was too hard.”

        No male role models. Jesus Christ.

        • Jankatarch@lemmy.worldEnglish
          2·
          3 days ago

          The part with electronics instructor is messed up ngl. Kathleen Booth and Margaret E Hamilton are role models to me and it feels like they are just ignored in computer science.

          • Wren@lemmy.todayEnglish
            2·
            3 days ago

            No kidding. I didn’t learn about a lot of women in science and arts until university, and even then it was sparse. My entire first year philosophy course didn’t talk about a single woman. I didn’t even learn about Rosalind Franklin and Lise Meitner until a feminist instructor brought them up, recommending books outside of the curriculum.

            A friend of mine, a guy, went on tour with a show about Lise Meitner around the time Oppenheimer came out, so people could learn about one of major contributors to the science nuclear fission who isn’t really talked about. That guy is one of my role models.

        • RamenJunkie@midwest.socialEnglish
          2·
          4 days ago

          Batman is a rich asshoke who could do more good for Gotham through philantropy than beating up goons in a mask.

          • Wren@lemmy.todayEnglish
            1·
            4 days ago

            He’s an interesting character. Ultimately, he is good, and, depending on the era in the comics, he nearly bankrupts his company trying to follow in his father’s footsteps.

            He’s also an archetype for fear and vengeance. His parents’ death motivates him to act against the corruption exposed in the justice system. He starts off as a young hooligan out for revenge, but with a solid ideology behind it — he thinks he’s saving people. Once he sees that violence begets violence, he tried to address the problems at the root and ultimately hangs up the mask.

            Most characters in Batman, including Bruce Wayne himself, have major trauma in their past. There are a lot or orphans, criminals by necessity, abused kids and victims of crime themselves. This was big for an era where people just did not talk about those things at the dinner table.

            In some comics they explore sci-fi means of removing trauma, to expose ones “true self.” While it breifly improves people’s lives, it just leaves the subjects more vulnerable and less resilient.

            Batman comics really explore how our past influences who we become, but also points out that everyone suffers, it’s what we do with that suffering that counts. Not only that, but learning from your past in a constant process.

            Batman isn’t everyone’s role model, but he is a role model.

        • MrKoyun@lemmy.worldEnglish
          1·
          3 days ago

          No role models? Yeah, thats not true.

          A couple of piece of shit role models whose influence is compounded by “the left” ignoring non-minority men, not taking their problems seriously and vilifying them over and over again? Now thats the problem. And comments like yours do not help, they only serve to drive those men further away from “the left”. It is way past time to stop making non-privilege a competition and accept that non-minority men have problems too that deserve attention. Doing so will end up benefiting everyone.

          -a “far-left” gay man

          • Wren@lemmy.todayEnglish
            1·
            3 days ago

            Minorities and queer folks are absolutely missing representation, as a socialist queer person.

            My comments have nothing to do with the imbalanced incarceration and vilification of men and everything to do with the thousands, possibly millions of role models men can choose to learn from.

            I grew up with all male role models because we just didn’t talk about major female contributions in school, and most women in fiction were relegated to side characters and love interests. No, it’s not a competition to see who has it worse, it’s a fact that citing incel talking points is not helping men see the world of potential beyond whatever “couple piece of shit role models” you’re talking about.

            • MrKoyun@lemmy.worldEnglish
              1·
              2 days ago

              I mean yeah, you’re right. Reading your og comment just sounded like you were placing the blame on men and making it a non-issue again.

              The couple of piece of shit role models I’m talking about are the “manly men alpha males” and their counterparts. I think we all know the type.

              • Wren@lemmy.todayEnglish
                1·
                1 day ago

                Those aren’t the only role models out there, their existence doesn’t erase others.

                I was calling out the idea that there are no male role models and did not in any way blame men for anything.

        • FenrirIII@lemmy.worldEnglish
          4·
          4 days ago

          Your response is a perfect example of how the mental health of men is constantly shit on. Just because women have it hard(er) doesn’t mean that men can’t suffer too.

          Toxic masculinity and “alpha” culture is a blight upon humanity and it’s scarring young boys who often have no real role models in their lives. Media is constantly blasting them with negativity and there’s no one in their lives to explain it or counter it.

          Your argument is that because women have it hard men need to shut up and deal with it. You’re just as much a problem as people like your electronics instructor. Too short-sighted and focused on your own myopic world view that you don’t care about anyone who isn’t like you.

          Shame on you.

          • Wren@lemmy.todayEnglish
            2·
            4 days ago

            Your argument is a perfect example of men feeling attacked when a woman tries to correct them.

            Forgot the whole part where I pointed out the many, many examples of male role models out there.

            • FenrirIII@lemmy.worldEnglish
              2·
              4 days ago

              Wow. You had to ‘correct’ me. The hubris is insane.

              As to your ‘list’ of rolemodels:

              • batman - rich orphan with serious mental issues who beats people up

              • superman - fictional character, but at least a decent person

              • presidents, prime ministers - Have you seen our leaders? They’re some of the worst people in the world

              • princes, emperors - hereditary rulers who have historically abused their power in unhealthy and evil ways

              • business leaders - Really? They’re worse than our elected politicians

              • most of hollywood directors - only role models for people who want to be directors

              • most doctors - What? Are doctors all figures of virtue and no one told me?

              • a million male authors writing about the male perspective - And there are no women authors out there doing the same?

              • There are women alive today who are legally not allowed to go anywhere alone. - And that sucks. It’s a cultural issue reinforced by poor male leadership that is systemic exactly what I’m trying to point out.

              • Jesus Christ - fictional but requires checking out your common sense and reason

              At this point I can’t tell if you’re trolling or not. I’m getting “All Lives Matter” flashbacks having to read your posts.

  • ThunderComplex@lemmy.todayEnglish
    13·
    5 days ago

    That’s pretty rude. I’d at least say goodbye politely before beaming up, but to just do it mid-conversation? Where are the manners?

  • chaotic_ugly@lemmy.zipEnglish
    8·
    5 days ago

    But non-medical/pre-medical transwomen are still women… Both the parents and the young lady get it wrong here.

    Edit: i stupid i know